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Wales: Other Welsh dragon flags


Last modified: 2016-11-03 by rob raeside
Keywords: wales | dragon |
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Variants with wording

[Flag of Wales] image by Tomislav Todorovic, 23 September 2016

The flag of Wales is sometimes amended with a red stripe at the top, the same shade as the dragon, charged with white inscription CYMRU. The size of dragon, relative to the white-green field, is larger than on the official
flag and it is set slightly off-centre, closer to the top. The typeface is very similar to Helvetica. This flag is sold by a number of online shops, such as here:
and just like the official flag, may have the ratio of either 2:3 or 3:5. The only real-life photo which displays it can currently be seen here:
Tomislav Todorovic, 23 September 2016

Welsh Pink Flag

[Pink Welsh Flag] image by Tomislav Todorovic, 24 September 2016

A Welsh LGBT flag is derived from the unofficial flag of Wales by repainting the dragon, as well as the top stripe charged with white inscription CYMRU, into pink. It is old by a number of online shops, such as here:
and seems to be in ratio 3:5 only. Its photo from the Pride Cymru 2014, taken in Cardiff on 2014-08-17, can be found here:
but it must have been used earlier, for a photo was published in the announcement of the said event at the PrideLife magazine website: in July same year.
Tomislav Todorovic, 24 September 2016

Golden Dragon on Black Flag outside "The Chepstow Castle"

[Golden Dragon Flag] image by David Lawrence, 22 September 2016

I came across these flags outside "The Chepstow Castle" (a pub in Chepstow) and despite taking several pictures I did not capture them well. This is the standard modern design of Welsh dragon as on Y Ddraig Goch - but this is a golden dragon on a black flag. The bartender told me that the owner of the pub had bought them recently (and on-line?) - but I have not located any on the internet yet.
David B Lawrence, 22 September 2016

If we took the traditional banner known as Y Ddraig Aur or "The Golden Dragon" which was raised over Caernarvon during the Battle of Tuthill in 1401 by Owain Glyndŵr, and gave it a black background, it would look like this. Anything close to what you saw? Of course, this doesn't identify the flag, but might be where the inspiration comes from.
Pete Loeser, 22 September 2016

If you took Y Ddraig Ddu or "The Black Dragon" used by the "Cymru 1400" Republican Movement on their flag and re-colored it gold, we'd get this. Anything close to what you saw? Of course, this doesn't identify the flag, but might be where the inspiration comes from.
Pete Loeser, 22 September2016

No, not what I saw. I think that Gethin or Sian designed this but I am not sure what their sources were. I presume that they had good historical sources (they founded Cofiwn) but I do not know them. This sort of flows into the whole argument as to how Owain Glyndwr contrived his quartered lions flag.
David B. Lawrence, 26 September 2016

Yesterday I saw a commercial sign which had the gold dragon on black. It was for the US company Cambria, a manufacturer of quartz surfaces ( Wiki source Cambria website The company's logo is the same as the UFE except that it includes the name CAMBRIA. They fly a version of the flag without the name, but with a gold sleeve. Perhaps they also fly one without the sleeve.
Ned Smith, 25 September 2016

Well, there was a dragon at the actual Chepstow Castle this August. I don't know whether there's a connection, though. Is this blue flag in the photograph actually black in real cloth, and are the shades of gold due to the light, or does it actually have multiple shades? I guess the owner would be the best source of information. He'd probably be proud to fly these flags, and would likely be quite willing to tell more about them.
Peter Hans van den Muijzenberg, 22 September 2016

That is exactly what I was speculating about; that somebody has been playing with Y Faner Wen and by placing Y Ddraig Aur onto Y Faner Du they have mimicked the colour scheme of Y Faner Dewi Sant. I have been arguing that The White Flag was an heraldic pun on "Gwynedd" as "The Holy/Sacred Land." (The words Gwen/Gwyn having connotations of white, pure, sacred, holy, etc.)
     Incidentally I was over to a party in Llanbedr and went for a walk around the old courtyard of St David's University College where there are similar bosses in the church roofs in different designs. These are early 19 century and their version of the heraldry does not have the escalloped cross but a straight-sided one as promoted by The Knights of St. David who created Y Faner Dewi Sant. (I presume that you know the story about the other St David cross flag which was a black cross on a golden flag ... I forget the details) I have not had a reply from The Chepstow Castle and I have still not found out where these came from, perhaps somebody will claim this dragon for Gloucestershire? (500 yards across the Wye bridge.) Perhaps Y Faner Du charged with Y Ddraig Aur is supposed to signal a Welsh of "No Surrender"?)
     I see that you have adapted (Gethin and Sian's?) artwork with the dragon gardant. I do not think that anybody can be really sure what these dragons looked like - I have suggested that the original Welsh dragon was puce (Y Ddraig Piws) because that then makes sense of The Leek as an emblem : normally it is depicted white stem, green leaves, purple thousand headed flower (decapitated). Puce/Piws means "Flea Coloured" i.e. "Blood Coloured :quot; which fits in better with the history of the imperial draco standards being dipped in blood which had a purple windsock i.e. the actual "flag" part of the original standards of Wales' precursor Britannia Prima (it was the only province of the western empire to not fall to the barbarians and I like to assume that "King" actually "Dwg/Dux" Arthur Pendragon was leading a cavalry troop up and down the A303 in Somerset where Wales is between Queen Camel, West Camel and Camel Hill - which is a lot of Camels ...) The dracos were made of gilded copper or brass.
I have to break off from this merry humour : you will excuse me for mentioning that I think that the proportions of this flag outside The Chepstow Castle were the same as in Y Faner Goch.
David B. Lawrence, 26 September 2016